airport security

[Isabella]

Do you mean this?

Having said that, I disagree with the notion that a full body search for each passenger doesn't reduce the risk of air terrorism. It seems that some sort of security search is necessary, and the degree of that search, is largely up for debate. I mean, would you fly if there was no security search?

I went ahead and quoted a fair amount of information, from experts who believe that no, a full body search for each passenger does not reduce the risk of air terrorism. And in fact, that's not what we have. We have a mix of metal detectors, scatter machines, and pat-downs. You and I also both agree there's racial profiling involved. We've also both read the information about the Israeli system, which is effective and does not physically search every--or even many--passengers. So you can disagree with that notion all you like, but you'll be incorrect until you provide some backup in the form of expert opinion or data.

To answer your direct question, I spent years flying before we had scatter machines and pat-downs, and I don't feel any safer now than I did then, so yes, I'd fly without pat-downs or scatters, and guess what? In Europe, I do all the time.

I'm still not seeing the answer where you side with one of these:

NO, a woman should not have to have been previously sexually assaulted to be exempt from having her genitals touched by a stranger in public;
or
YES, a woman should have to have been previously sexually assaulted to be exempt from having her genitals touched by a stranger in public.

Because I'm inferring that you do think there should be an exception for rape victims, but I'm not sure why this trauma should be any more special than any other; conversely I'm not sure why one should have to have suffered previous trauma to be excused from dehumanizing and inappropriate touching by pseudo-authority figures.


*******
YES I GET IT, I have crossed over into "arguing on the internet is like running in the Special Olympics" territory, but I care big time about this issue, it affects me directly about once every two weeks, I have spent a crapload of time reading and thinking about it, and now that I've been called out I am on this bus to the end of the fucking line. So I'm being a little cranky here, but I genuinely want to know, is having been raped good enough to get you out of the pat-down, and if it is, why do you have to have been raped to get out of the pat-down? Do we say to a little kid, unless you previously got molested, the TSA is going to touch you there?

(Huff, huff)

[devinio]

One thing that I see happen on these types of forums a lot is that people run back and forth in circles saying the same thing about the same stuff over and over. The beginning of that usually starts with one person asking the exact same thing they asked 5 posts ago, and getting the same answer, only much longer and twice as angry. I'm not into it.

I answered your question to the best of my ability, but I felt that you took a complex issue and attempted to boil it down to a simple yes or no question designed to illicit maximum response. So my answer did not come in the form of a yes or no. I cannot compel you to be satisfied with my answer, in the same sense that you cannot compel me to answer yes or no when I don't feel it's appropriate. I read all of your articles, considered what I had read before, and my opinion remains essentially unchanged, although I am open to the idea that I could be wrong.

So just to be clear, my issue was with tactics, not facts of security. So, if you are interested in discussing the merits of how to deal with a piece of "security theatre" perceived or actual, then perhaps we can go a few rounds. However, if your primary interest is to debate the finer points and merits of our current security procedures, and whether or not they constitute "security theatre" then I will have to oblige you in your quest for the last word.

Now at this point, if I were a casual observer I would be asking this question:
"Why is this person posting in a forum thread about airport security if he doesn't have an interest in it?"

Basically, I wandered in here out of boredom one day. I noticed something unrelated to airport security that set me off, and posted about that before I really considered the current topic of the thread, or even thought it through for that matter. I'm sure most of us have done that a few times.