The Heavy Thread for arguing the toss.

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  • jester
    Senior Member
    • Dec 2000
    • 1084

    #61
    Okay, so by your definition you aren't a hippy.

    Not by my definition, my definition of a hippy is somebody who has attempted to abandon all vested interest in the status quo, thus making their being further free to improve the world and challenge capitalism. While this is invariably flawed I find the aspirations admirable.

    "Many People" is not a cop out, but I shall clarify. The few people who have discussed this aternative to the status quo with me are the "many people" I was refering to. This is not an accurate sample of people who believe in survival of the co-operative and is drawn solely upon my own experience. I think that was clear to even the dimmest subscribers to this thread.

    Don't ever compare me to Fox TV! I don't compare you to Rupert Murdoch, although you have become a little arrogant and often use your much admired social status on this group to bully people when your wit and intellect aren't in full swing.

    Now the jester bit. I provoked. You bit. End of Story. I believe what I said. If I am wrong, then I am happy to debate it with you. I am a provocative son of a bitch. You are the biggest scalp to date, although I think I got you riled up with a thing about mimes a few years ago too.

    I think you have lost sight of your own logic with the dignity dribble. Jesters assume the position of a fool so that they are free of dignity. Dignity is about how you feel about the perception that others have of you, it is not quite the same thing as self esteem. You cannot insult me by suggesting I have no dignity, and this is the second time you have tried it. It doesn't work. I AM A SHAMELESS WANKER! It is an argument you cannot win.

    And your comments about my lack of dignity are a primitive form of social bullying, an attempt at attacking my self esteem, it's a subtle way of saying "and nobody else likes you either." So what. They are a forgiving bunch and they can like or dislike whatever they want.

    As for logicly cornered, You have NEVER logically cornered Jester. And if I was in it for the money I'd be doing a lot better than I am now. Having read your client list, I think my ethical policy is probably up to as close scrutiny as yours.

    Just because I challenged the views of Co-operitives it does not mean that I am in favour of the status quo.

    Just because I have often said I admire you does not mean I unconditionally admire you, nor that I am afraid of your superior wit.

    If you are going to argue the toss with me could you be a little more concise? The whole point of knowing so many words is that you can say exactly what you mean with less effort.

    Now as for the sarcasm.... Martin, Tut Tut! I wasn't promoting unhappiness... I was accusing you and the cooperative survivalists of doing just that yourself.

    Last edited by jester; Dec-05-2004, 02:21 PM.

    Comment

    • jester
      Senior Member
      • Dec 2000
      • 1084

      #62
      I'm impatient

      I don't have a polar mindset. I hate polar mindsets. Sometimes people disagree with you, it doesn't automaticly mean polar mindset.

      In fact if anything I am a wishy washy kind of liberal who adopts different polarities for convenience at the time.

      Now are you going to convince me that survival of the cooperative is a good thing or do I have to do it myself.

      Comment

      • jester
        Senior Member
        • Dec 2000
        • 1084

        #63
        Re: I'm so mean I poke at Beagles

        [QUOTE]Originally posted by martin ewen
        [B]That was your point, good, target acquired.


        And what do you say....
        You say that because by your definition of collective sometimes bad things are done in its name then the concept of economic and social symbiosis which has yet to be formally studied but has emerged recently in viable commercial applications is without merit or further investigation.
        Your gory emotive group rapes and warlords simply and efficiently (you seem to believe) put paid to any potential alternative to the present global economic system (despite evidence to the contrary) with its inherent injustice wherein whole counties continents and global environments are figuratively raped to provide for a minority who’s justification can, in part be based on the concept that ‘survival’ is inherently linked, unwaveringly and in every definable way with ‘competition’.
        This socioeconomic Darwinism conveniently and simplistically equates, ‘fitness’ with wealth and calmly equates poverty with extinction.
        Any curiosity or interpretation of reality that attempts to otherwise counter or define profitable alternatives to the current system is, I understand, in your opinion an admission of ‘hippiedom’

        And I reply:

        No they don't put paid to any alternative, I just don't believe that civilisation and the evolution of organised society was a pleasant or peaceful process. Our social development owes a lot to greed, violence and intelligent manipulation of group thinking. Of course a lot of good has slowly come out of this and we are slowly improving (bloody slowly) and our even the most basic education makes for relatively pleasant and peaceful citizens.

        To pretend that we evolved because of our "inner good co-operative" nature is nonsense and is not a basis for moving forward. Good and co-operative nature has survived in spite of all that is awful about us, thanks to a few brave and strong individuals who pushed for what is right.

        Our intelligence led us to be partly cooperative, but mainly oppressed and organised and obedient.

        We need to accept what is shit, accept that it has happened and persuade people that just because we got this far by being intelligent collectives of thugs is not an excuse to carry on in the same way.

        We can prove that cooperative behaviour is the way forward, played a part in our progress but needs to play a bigger part in our future. I can see that there needs to be more emphasis on this and that people use the "survival of the fittest - life is tough" as an excuse for bad behaviour. But I don't think cooperative and intelligent are the same thing and I think it is our intelligence that is important here.

        Now I will hold my hands up and say I was wrong to criticise because in truth I have not studied this recently to anything like the level I would like to and it is a shame that I cannot study this course from here in the UK.

        Are you studying this course?
        Last edited by jester; Dec-12-2004, 05:26 PM.

        Comment

        • martin ewen
          Senior Member
          • Dec 2000
          • 1887

          #64
          assuming your interest is more than an echochamber

          a good place to start is
          Steven Johnson's 2002 book Emergence: the Connected lives of Ants, Brains, Cities and Software.

          Comment

          • Magrat2005
            Senior Member
            • Feb 2005
            • 333

            #65


            *falls off chair, pissing herself*

            you guys crack me up, i was just wanted to say

            *i live in england, i want to shoot myself
            *though Jester is my mate, that picture with the target with bloody funny
            *and that 'cool test' thats great

            *still rolling over floor, laughing*

            Comment

            • Famos Bramwells
              Member
              • Dec 2000
              • 58

              #66
              If ,after you have grilled your red peppers until they are black, you put them for a short while in a paper bag, (or pan with the lid on) the skins come off really easily. Then just slice and add to your favourite recipe. Yum.

              Comment

              • Magrat2005
                Senior Member
                • Feb 2005
                • 333

                #67
                I had to look through this thread again cuz I love it, makes me laugh

                btw - if it wasnt for Jonathan the Jester coming to my school with his comic rants then I would never have gotten interested in politics

                Comment

                • jester
                  Senior Member
                  • Dec 2000
                  • 1084

                  #68
                  What school did you go to then?

                  Comment

                  • Magrat2005
                    Senior Member
                    • Feb 2005
                    • 333

                    #69
                    hahaha....I anit telling, you might go there and ask about me, and find out where I live and stuff, then stalk me hahaha

                    Comment

                    • jester
                      Senior Member
                      • Dec 2000
                      • 1084

                      #70
                      The thought that I inspired you to pay an interest in your democratic duties fills me with immeasurable pride.

                      Did you heckle me?

                      Comment

                      • Magrat2005
                        Senior Member
                        • Feb 2005
                        • 333

                        #71
                        no, I laughed, I'm in good mood, so I laughed..hahaha

                        Comment

                        • Magrat2005
                          Senior Member
                          • Feb 2005
                          • 333

                          #72
                          Originally posted by jester
                          The thought that I inspired you to pay an interest in your democratic duties fills me with immeasurable pride.

                          Did you heckle me?
                          good, im glad, HAHAHAHAHA, now i heckle you, my peace-loving-tree-hugging-hippie-dude....or gal (you know that picture Le Pire posted hehehe)

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