did you know?

[scot]

27 monkeys were used in the shooting of the movie "Twelve monkeys". We need more topics

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scot nery
mailto:scot@juggle.comscot@juggle.com</A>
deadjugglers.com

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[Peter Voice]

I don't know, chance, no matter how slowly I type for you, you still can't seem to read. I did not suggest that all US radio stations (I believe there are over 11,000) entered this agreement (nor did I use the number 6 anywhere) and the only broadcaster quoted by Roebuck was Rupert Murdock (Fox among others) because the article was published in Murdock papers. There was no retraction or denial.
I can understand why "Clear", or any other stations not party to this agreement, would wish to distance themselves from it.
As to my motives, xenophobia would be inaccurate and whilst I find individual Americans no different to any other people I've met, I will admit I dislike the collective US psyche. Call it anti-US if you wish, but you should note that I think exactly the same thing about Australians. Perhaps misanthropic is the word you are looking for.
Now read carefully, chance, I can't type any slower.


[This message has been edited by Peter Voice (edited 12-10-2001).]

[Chance]

When you're right, you're right! You didn't say 6, you said 8. And you didn't say stations, you said broadcasters. Which still changes none of the facts: that your original post was simply passing on a recent urban myth which has no basis in fact, eg, documented public statements from either the US Govt OR a single US radio station/broadcaster which supports the original false claim -- which no one is accusing you of starting, just passing on... Is it really so hard to just say, "Oh shit, why didn't I check into that myself before spouting off." Just like when you pass on things you hear from other buskers with an axe to grind before fact-checking. When you sling mud you get just as dirty as the one you are aiming at.

[Peter Voice]

I was merely relating a piece of information that I found astoundingly curious, nefarious or otherwise. I didn't realise that any-one would take it personally. Mudslinging misanthrope, I may be, but chance(sic), don't call me a careless writer.

[Chance]

Call it what you will, Peter, but AJ began this topic with a very general discussion on a rare mineral being mined for use in cell phones. Nothing -- nada, zip, zero, zilch --was in reference to the US. The very next post, yours, was typical US bashing.

Then, surprise, surprise, here you are scant weeks later and your FOLLOW UP post was just more of the same.

And when confronted, rather than research the facts yourself, or (God forbid) recant your original position, you make personal attacks against the person taking notice, who just happens to be from the US.

Imagine that.

I was in no way offended by the (supposed) content of the 'radio' message you posted. On the other hand, I found the anti-US slant quite offensive, hence my bothering to reply.

The only thing more stupid than xenophobia and prejudice (whatever the PC name may be) is --sorry but I can't think of anything more stupid.

As for mud slinging and careless writing, you might bother to remind yourself not to go around spreading the lies your friends tell you. Maybe this link will help refresh your memory: http://www.performers.net/ubb/Forum10/HTML/000137.html

[martin ewen]

Fuck- not the shoes

Short summery.
Brady, while never literally accusing and always alluding hounded chance for years about a pair of shoes he lost.
(their personalities clash-fancy that)
Chance would always rise to the bait and brady would slink off amused only to bring it up a month or so later with the usual predictible results.
Because of pressure and being ground down by complaints from on of the parties involved about besmirchment of character. Jim wrote to brady and pleaded with him not to continue as it was affecting him in that he had to deal with the results.
Brady persisted and Jim took his entry off the board and Brady hasn't been on here since.
Brady was really funny , I miss brady because he's a lunatic with a cunning intelligence and a good heart.
The shoe saga became history, it had run it's course.
Now we have a last word competition between another old ego rivalry about nothing more than a possible radio list (but subtextually so, so much more)
And the shoes are brought up again by the only person who ever asked that the subject be dropped.
Chance--no-one in the entire world ever thought that you had anything to do with the shoes, not brady, not anyone.
Please don't reply, just sigh and put it behind you.
You could tie me to a chair, force feed me over-boiled broad beans, sew my eyelids open and project little house on the prairie re-runs till my brain melted and you still couldn't bore me as much as the fucking shoes do.

[Peter Voice]

chance, if you go way back to feb. you may recall that Prof told you a drunken cockney magician had the shoes. Maybe she typed too fast for you.

[Chance]

Eyelids? Beans? Shoes? Oh brother! Don't suppose we could stay on topic just this one time? I am still waiting to hear if there actually is any documented proof behind the radio allegations, or whether, as I suspect, it was just another weak excuse to bash my country.

[This message has been edited by Chance (edited 12-11-2001).]

[Scot Free]

Alice In Chains, "Rooster"
Alice In Chains, "Sea of Sorrow"
Alice In Chains, "Down in a Hole"
Alice In Chains, "Them Bones"
Beastie Boys, "Sure Shot"
Beastie Boys, "Sabotage"
The Cult, "Fire Woman"
Everclear, "Santa Monica (Watch the World Die)"
Filter, Hey Man, "Nice Shot"
Foo Fighters, "Learn to Fly"
Savage Garden, "Crash and Burn"
Dave Matthews Band, "Crash Into Me"
Bangles, "Walk Like an Egyptian"
Pretenders, "My City Was Gone"
Alanis Morissette, "Ironic"
Barenaked Ladies, "Falling for the First Time"
Fuel, "Bad Day"
Korn, "Falling Away From Me"
Red Hot Chili Peppers, "Aeroplane"
Red Hot Chili Peppers, "Under the Bridge"
Smashing Pumpkins, "Bullet With Butterfly Wings"
Peter Gabriel, "When You're Falling"
System Of A Down, "Chop Suey!"
Lenny Kravitz, "Fly Away"
Tom Petty, "Free Fallin'"
Bruce Springsteen, "I'm On Fire"
Bruce Springsteen, "Goin' Down"
Phil Collins, "In the Air Tonight"
Limp Bizkit, "Break Stuff"
Green Day, "Brain Stew"
Temple Of The Dog, "Say Hello to Heaven"
Sugar Ray, "Fly"
Local H, "Bound for the Floor"
Slipknot, "Left Behind, Wait and Bleed"
Bush, "Speed Kills"
311, "Down"
Stone Temple Pilots, "Dead and Bloated"
Soundgarden, "Fell on Black Days"
Soundgarden, "Black Hole Sun"
Metallica, "Seek and Destroy"
Metallica, "Harvester of Sorrow"
Metallica, "Enter Sandman"
Metallica, "Fade to Black"
Nine Inch Nails, "Head Like a Hole"
Godsmack, "Bad Religion"
Tool, "Intolerance"
Soundgarden, "Blow Up the Outside World"
Nena, "99 Luft Balloons/99 Red Balloons"
AC/DC, "Shot Down in Flames"
AC/DC, "Shoot to Thrill"
AC/DC, "Dirty Deeds"
AC/DC, "Highway to Hell"
AC/DC, "Safe in New York City"
AC/DC, "TNT"
AC/DC, "Hell's Bells"
Black Sabbath, "War Pigs"
Black Sabbath, "Sabbath Bloody Sabbath"
Black Sabbath, "Suicide Solution"
Kansas, "Dust in the Wind"
Led Zeppelin, "Stairway to Heaven"
The Beatles, "A Day in the Life"
The Beatles, "Lucy in the Sky with Diamonds"
The Beatles, "Ticket To Ride"
The Beatles, "Obla Di, Obla Da"
Bob Dylan/Guns N Roses, "Knockin' on Heaven's Door"
Arthur Brown, "Fire"
Blue Oyster Cult, "Burnin' For You"
Paul McCartney & Wings, "Live and Let Die"
Jimi Hendrix, "Hey Joe"
Jackson Browne, "Doctor My Eyes"
John Mellencamp, "Crumbling Down"
John Mellencamp, "Paper In Fire"
U2, "Sunday Bloody Sunday"
Boston, "Smokin"
Billy Joel, "Only the Good Die Young"
Dio, "Holy Diver"
Steve Miller, "Jet Airliner"
Van Halen, "Jump"
Queen, "Another One Bites the Dust"
Queen, "Killer Queen"
Pat Benatar, "Hit Me with Your Best Shot"
Pat Benatar, "Love is a Battlefield"
Oingo Boingo, "Dead Man's Party"
REM, "It's the End of the World as We Know It"
Talking Heads, "Burning Down the House"
Judas Priest, "Some Heads Are Gonna Roll"
Pink Floyd, "Run Like Hell"
Pink Floyd, "Mother"
John Parr, "St. Elmo's Fire"
Barry McGuire, "Eve of Destruction"
Steam, "Na Na Na Na Hey Hey"
Drifters, "On Broadway"
Shelly Fabares, "Johnny Angel"
Los Bravos, "Black is Black"
Peter & Gordon, "I Go To Pieces"
Peter & Gordon, "A World Without Love"
Elvis Presley, "(You're the) Devil in Disguise"
Zombies, "She's Not There"
Elton John, "Bennie & The Jets"
Elton John, "Daniel"
Elton John, "Rocket Man"
Jerry Lee Lewis, "Great Balls of Fire"
Santana, "Evil Ways"
Louis Armstrong, "What A Wonderful World"
Youngbloods, "Get Together"
Ad Libs, "The Boy from New York City"
Peter Paul & Mary, "Blowin' in the Wind"
Peter Paul & Mary, "Leavin' on a Jet Plane"
Rolling Stones, "Ruby Tuesday"
Simon & Garfunkel, "Bridge Over Troubled Water"
Happenings, "See You in Septemeber"
Carole King, "I Feel the Earth Move"
Zager & Evans, "In the Year 2525"
Norman Greenbaum, "Spirit in the Sky"
Brooklyn Bridge, "Worst That Could Happen"
Three Degrees, "When Will I See You Again"
Cat Stevens, "Peace Train"
Cat Stevens, "Morning Has Broken"
Jan & Dean, "Dead Man's Curve"
Martha & The Vandellas, "Nowhere to Run"
Martha & The Vandellas/Van Halen, "Dancing in the Streets"
Hollies, "He Ain't Heavy, He's My Brother"
Sam Cooke/Herman's Hermits, "Wonderful World"
Petula Clark, "A Sign of the Times"
Don Mclean, "American Pie"
J. Frank Wilson/Pearl Jam, "Last Kiss"
Buddy Holly & The Crickets, "That'll Be the Day"
John Lennon, "Imagine"
Bobby Darin, "Mack the Knife"
The Clash, "Rock the Casbah"
Surfaris, "Wipeout"
Blood Sweat & Tears, "And When I Die"
Dave Clark Five, "Bits and Pieces"
Tramps, "Disco Inferno"
Paper Lace, "The Night Chicago Died"
Frank Sinatra, "New York, New York"
Creedence Clearwater Revival, "Travelin' Band"
The Gap Band, "You Dropped a Bomb On Me"
Alien Ant Farm, "Smooth Criminal"
3 Doors Down, "Duck and Run"
The Doors, "The End"
Third Eye Blind, "Jumper"
Neil Diamond, "America"
Skeeter Davis, "End of the World"
Ricky Nelson, "Travelin' Man"
Chi-Lites, "Have You Seen Her"
Animals, "We Gotta Get Out of This Place"
Fontella Bass, "Rescue Me"
Mitch Ryder, "Devil with the Blue Dress"
James Taylor, "Fire and Rain"
Edwin Starr/Bruce Springsteen, "War"
Lynyrd Skynyrd, "Tuesday's Gone"
Drowning Pool, "Bodies"
Mudvayne, "Death Blooms"
Megadeth, "Dread and the Fugitive"
Megadeth, "Sweating Bullets"
Saliva, "Click Click Boom"
P.O.D., "Boom"

Here is the contentious list of 150 songs that Clear Channel (owner of 1170 radio stations in the U.S., 240 International plus affiliates)"requested" not be played by their stations in the wake of Sept.11th. Clear Channel feels that these songs are too "sensitive" and too inflammatory to expose the Public to.

It took me 30 seconds to find this list on the net, therefore I will not cite the source. I assume anyone reading this has access to a search engine and if there is still doubt check it out, there are tons of sites that will come up as a result for "radio no play list" search.

I don't consider posting such information (even if it is second or third hand) America bashing. The spirit of the original post seemed to me to be:
"wow, look what these corperate sickoos have done now- They banned the Beatles for singing a peace song during a war"

It does beg to question the dominant authoritarian ideology of the corerate eleite who run the U.S. and by default the rest of the world.
Who needs an excuse to bash them?


[This message has been edited by Scot Free (edited 12-11-2001).]

[Jim]

Well put, Scot. How would you like a moderator position?

[Jim]

Peter, Chance actually posted that link to snopes: http://www.snopes2.com/rumors/radio.htm
(They're actually quite reliable in the rumor-busting they do.) The songs weren't 'banned.' But Clear Channel DID distribute the list with the 'suggestion' to avoid playing the songs in an obviously sensitive time.

So there. End of argument.

The next person to mention tennis shoes loses their membership to performers.net.

[Jim]

Hey, speaking of snopes...

Here's and interesting and TRUE tidbit :

http://www.snopes2.com/rumors/falwell.htm

[Peter Voice]

Thank you Scot, I'm glad some-one actually read my post as it was written. I never said the songs were banned, I merely pointed out that a tacit agreement had been made between some of the world's (not just America's) broadcasting moguls to remove them from US (and probably others) playlists. It seemed particularly poignant after George Harrisons death.
In Aust we have another particularly powerful but quiet media mogul (who owns considerable US broadcasting interests) called Ita Butrosse. Ita has a particularly strong lisp (which would be a problem for a less capable radio personality, but then Kerry Packer, who owns nearly as much of the world's printed media as Rupert Murdock, is dyslexic, so what can I say), referred to the agreement, on air (Melb 3LO, Am 770), as "the case of the mithing thongs" (absolutely true, but it is an antipodean joke that might get me banned from p.net if Jim gets it).
chance's problem is not so much what I wrote or even it's veracity, but simply that I wrote it. I do apologise to those that are subjected to our mutual antagonism but I do at least attempt to make it entertaining. I am looking forward to celebrating some of his good works after he decided to reinvent himself post-Sept. 11.
Strangely, I was under the impression this was the place for open and honest debate.
Jim, perhaps you should put some instructions in the "users guide" to tell us how to deregister ourselves, save youself the trouble.


[This message has been edited by Peter Voice (edited 12-12-2001).]

[Jim]

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" size="2">Originally posted by Peter Voice:
Thank you Scot, I'm glad some-one actually read my post as it was written. I never said the songs were banned,

Peter, I don't want to pull a 'Chance' here (Forgive me Chance) but you DID use the word 'banned' in your original post. You said "... but Imagine remains banned."

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" size="2">Originally posted by Peter Voice:
I merely pointed out that a tacit agreement had been made between some of the world's (not just America's) broadcasting moguls to remove them from US (and probably others) playlists.

...And Chance pointed out that this simply wasn't true. No efforts were made to remove Imagine from any playlists. It may have been suggested to program directors that playing certain songs would upset people, but the songs weren't banned.

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" size="2">Originally posted by Peter Voice:
"the case of the mithing thongs" (absolutely true, but it is an antipodean joke that might get me banned from p.net if Jim gets it).

Thay 'thongs' all you want, but thay 'thneakers' and you'll thertainly get a bunth of people riled up...

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" size="2">Originally posted by Peter Voice:
Strangely, I was under the impression this was the place for open and honest debate.

Duh?!? Peter, I was kidding about banning people because they mention Brady's sneakers. COME ON!

You're the last person I thought would get that upset about a joke. This IS a place for open and honest discussion. But HELLO??? (I'm asking everyone here) Why do people insist on being such jerks to each other? Why have there been less than a 10 posts outside the Blah Blah Blah forum in the last two weeks??? What is so fascinating about discussing peoples' sexuality for over 100 posts when we can't seem to break a dozen posts in the "Festival and Pitch Ethics" Forum in the past year??? Is this a Gay and Lesbian support group or a forum for the discussion and advancement of our respective performing careers?

This site is a place to discuss all types of topics, yes, but sometimes I wonder how serious people are about actually improving their careers and improving their performances. We each carry a wealth of experience and information in our heads... imagine how cool it would be if that knowledge were typed out in a searchable forum system? There are a few people here who consistently share positive useful information without hesitation. But I'll say it again... over 300 of the 430 'registered' members have NEVER posted to a single forum. And of the 50 regular posters, most have not posted outside of Blah Blah Blah.

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" size="2">Originally posted by Peter Voice:
Jim, perhaps you should put some instructions in the "users guide" to tell us how to deregister ourselves, save youself the trouble.

There is a difference between censoring and moderating. Yes, I've deleted people's posts in the past. (about 4 individual posts; not threads, not users... 4 posts in the last year) And yes, I've explained to those people exactly WHY I deleted their posts. When discussions get out of hand, begin to get repetitive or are simply off topic and inappropriate for a thread, I'll politely ask the person offline to restrain themselves and/or 'think' before posting again. If they continue to post pointless, antagonistic garbage, I will close the thread or ask them to stop publicly to give everyone a chance to cool down. I have NEVER banned anyone or removed ANYONE'S posting priveleges.

Having this forum system in place is a choice I made. Now I have to deal with it. It's on the WEB. Anyone in the world can join in a conversation or a rant or a flame. But if I just let it run amuck, it would serve no useful purpose for anybody. It's like a plant or a vine... sometimes a branch will get out of hand and it needs to be pruned... not removed; just cut back a bit so it stays healthy.

I'm not here to silence anybody, but I do feel it's my job to speak out when flames begin and the stupid, antagonistic blather begins to flow. I'm just trying to keep this ship sailing in a positive direction. For everyone's benefit.

Jim

P.S. Peter, you have the ability to edit your personal profile by clicking the "PROFILE" link at the top of any page. I will not de-register you... or anybody.

[Prof Willie B]

185 registered members have posted in topics outside Blah, Blah, Blah and, exactly, 50 different unregistered people posted in the "gigs" section, 38 of whom registered after their first post. There have been 3404 contributions to this site in a year.
Of 436 registered members 192 have registered within the last 100 days.
I personally think it would take a few weeks for even an experienced UBB user to get any sort of handle on this lot let alone some-one new to this technology and I'm only talking about the internet, not the egos, rivalry or the depth of good stuff that's to be found here.

Some-one else here went into a rave about how few people he thought were contributing to this site but the line of discussion was discontinued before we looked at the actual figures.
Many people will take time to get into this site and in some subject lines there are some pretty definitive writings that, until circumstances change, need little more discussion (many such writings perhaps should be moved/copied to the library which is sadly being neglected in favour of these boards). I'm still rather reluctant to register on any website until I understand it thoroughly so I assume there are lots of people reading who still haven't registered (I'd guess 3 to 1 but the cookie count doesn't help here because everybody moves too much and uses too many different machines)
Jim, you seem somehow disappointed but have not really subjectively analysed the content and quality of what happened since the old site fell down. Can you possibly guess at the number of people who have quietly and successfully pulled off some great shit behind the scenes but as a direct result of this site? Nick, Lynneski, Martin, any-one have anything to say on this point?

Btw. a "thong" in some parts of the world is an entirely different piece of apparel, it could only be described as footwear by a few unusually endowed men.