Free Busker Act for the animal shelter

[Ottawa Humane Society]

September 9, we need outside performers with a soft spot for pooches and cats, we have 1000 people coming to our 13th annual Wiggle Waggle Walkathon, we need entertainment and we are willing to give you lots of advertising, radio coverage, corporate mention on t-shirts. We need help form 10 am to noon or 12.30. Anyone interested? I wish we could pay but it's great exposure and you will really be helping the Humane Society.

[worldwidese]

We wish you could pay too! Buskers are not in the high income bracket, and it's a lot to ask them to donate their time to perform for exposure. That doesn't pay the rent. There are plenty of high income folks and corporations who could help the Shelter by sponsoring the performence for a chance to get THEIR exposure. That way you would get better quality entertainment. All it takes is some of your commitee's time to get the sponsors.

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" size="2">Originally posted by Ottawa Humane Society:
September 9, we need outside performers with a soft spot for pooches and cats, I wish we could pay but it's great exposure and you will really be helping the Humane Society.

[Orange]

i don't think it's that bad for them to ask this. alot of buskerfests don't pay performers, and maybe that is a bad thing, but this is a good cause, and as a performer who is also a supporter of animals rights, i would do this fest if i lived in ottawa, or close.

[Chance]

A fund raiser for AIDS or a world hunger campaign, **these** are worthy causes. Sign me up! But it fries my brain when activists put animal "rights" on the same level as those of human beings. (And this comes from someone who was raised on a farm with no less than 7 dogs, two horses and about 50 cats.)

[Orange]

just because you consider human rights to be more important than animal rights, it doesn't mean that animals don't deserve rights aswell. someone has to stick up for those who can't do it for themselves.

[Chance]

In many countries an animal shelter would look an awful lot like a supermarket, and the only rights afforded there would be, "dark meat or light?".

[Todd]

OK, if you really want to do this gig, to help out a struggling good cause, and not feel cheated, then donate your time and write it off on your taxes.
Send them a letter saying you will donate your time to them and list your normal rate you would charge for a corporate gig, then get the organization to give you a letter saying that you made a charitable donation to them of your time, and since your time is money, you can write off on your taxes. It is totally win/win.
I've done this before for organizations that I wish to support but do not have the finances to pay a full rate.

And at the risk of getting into this debate, I just want to clear up a misunderstanding that seems to be happening over what a Humane Society is. A Humane Society, and 'animal rights' organizations like PETA have different mission statements. Most Humane Societies are an alternative to animal shelters that kill thier animals once a month. Instead of killing them, the animals live there until adopted. While many PETA members may work for a Humane Society, they are not one in the same.

[Steven Ragatz]

On the topic of being able to write off donations of "time"...

I asked my tax attorney about this. I wondered if I "donated" a performance to a not-for-profit organization, would I be able to take a deduction based on my rate if I arranged the appropriate letters etc. He literally laughed in my face. His reply was no. His explanation was that one couldn't place a rate on such an item as "time" or a commodity like a "performance". He said that it would be impossible to determine the fee as there is no market information on which to base the value.

Now, I don't really have total confidence in this guy, so I am not going to take his word for it verbatim, but his explanation was most convincing and it seemed plausible. If anyone out there has some legal experience in the matter, and knows how this sort of thing works, I would love to hear how it can be done. Otherwise, I am convinced that one cannot legally do it unless there is an actual exchange of money. Then, of course, you have to declare the income before you donate it back.

If you hired ten different tax attorneys to do your return, you would undoubtedly owe ten different amounts...

Steven Ragatz

[Stretch]

No, you can't get a business or tax deduction for donating your time. (the IRS doesn't want your time, just your money! :&gt; )) You can however claim the milage and any supplies you might have used in the course of your performance. ie milage to and from the event, and supplies such as balloons, or fuel for your torches. This would be for a recognised charity with the designation from the IRS.

A charitable event is, of course a good reason for YOU to send out press releases, etc.. Don't wait on the charity to promote you, be proactive and do it your self.

Walking tall and stretching imaginations!

Bill "Stretch" Coleman

http://Stiltwalker.com/

------------------
Walking tall and stretching imaginations!
Bill 'Stretch' Coleman

[Todd]

Thanks for the feed-back guys.
I've heard various things regarding this issue from various accountants but I've been told that, your show is a product ,and donating a performance, to a charity is like a craftsman donating a product to a charity.
But I will look into your takes on this further.
Thanks

[This message has been edited by Todd (edited 07-01-2001).]

[Todd]

Ok, I just called a buddy of mine, and got the scoop on this. They are getting ready to put another change in the tax code, and one of the things under consideration is allowing business people who specialize in the performing arts to write off donations of the kind we have been discussing.
I assume that there may be charts, graphs and other confusing and red-tape filled systems of measurement to determine 'market-value' of said 'product'. But as of late there has been no decisions as to weather or not this will happen. Odds are on NO.
Thanks for the tips gang. Egg on my face.

[This message has been edited by Todd (edited 07-02-2001).]

[BFlat]

I'd rather not get involved in discussion about this anymore. I've done it so much before and I've heard all the excuses in favor and against.

All I want to say here is about this famous sentence: "we are willing to give you lots of advertising, radio coverage, corporate mention on t-shirts..." That one too I have heard many times. My humble opinion? BULLSHIT, I'm not buying this anymore.

from someone who used to beleive in that crap and who's been on TV more than 200 times, on the radio more than a dozen times, in the newspaper countless number of times throughout her life... and whom people still aren't asking for autographs when she walks on the streets.

T-Shirt, special mentions, radio shows, media ect DON'T help one's exposure. What does is how YOU respect and present yourself. Any charity organization, no matter how noble their cause may be, if they are serious about doing a fund raising, should treat the people they are asking help seriously. To them I say; Just say the damn truth. Just say that you are looking for volunteers if you can't afford to pay them but cut the crap about the exposure and about "Oh you'll be in the paper" kind of thing. My name and my picture have been printed into various newspaper, etc and all I've gotten from that were simply more people and charity organization calling me asking me to volunteer. It's like publicity that says "I work for free". The government helps such charities, maybe not a lot, but it does. But it doesn't help street performers. So once and for all use the money that the government supplies you at the right place. Thank you very much.

[Lynneski]

This sounds like it's verging into the "we should be paid" thread.

On the subject of donating one's performance in return for a tax deduction, my experience has been that one may donate a good or service "in-kind", but the only way to get a deduction (in Ontario, anyways) is to have the agency pay you for the performance/product and then you donate the amount back as cash.

Doesn't exactly work out equitably, because the performer has to declare the income (right?!?), and only gets a portion of the year's worth of donations deducted from taxes owing. I'm sure there's a math brain out there that can figure out what percentage MORE the agency would have to pay you in order to make up for the disparity in income tax versus deduction.

If you're established as a business, rather than an individual, you might be able to write off the gig as a marketing expense. But as Bill sez, probably only the amount you are out of pocket, rather than the value of lost income.

In short, it makes bad business sense from the numbers side. And it doesn't work from an exposure perspective, unless the media in which you are featured is targetted at folks who are likely to hire you in future, rather than the public at large.

'Course, everyone has causes they choose to support, and their own (non-financial) reasons for doing so.

Lynne

[mnozzolio]

It wasn't clear from the first post, but would performers at least be allowed to pass the hat? If so, it seems that the issue of being paid by the organizers would be moot. Aren't we always looking for places to perform? The least the organizers could do is allow hat passing.

[theballoonman]

WOW,I THOUGHT I WAS BITTER AND JADED...
CANADA ISNT REGULATED BY THE IRS(NOT YET)
AND ATAX RECIEPT IS GREAT...CHARGE A GREAT CORPORATE RATE AND WRITE IT OFF...
EVEN IF YOU DO DECLARE IT AS INCOME,ITS PROBABLY THE BEST INCOME TO DECLARE...
(ONE WITH A TAX EXEMPTION)
IF THATS NOT YOUR CAUSE,THEN DONT VOLUNTEER,I'VE ALWAYS FOUND GREAT REWARDS FOR THE FREE STUFF I'VE DONE,MONETARILY AND TO MYSELF...NOT ALWAYS IMMEDIATLY,BUT ALWAYS.
ALL I'M SAYING IS GIVE PEAS A CHANCE
PULL MY FINGER
MIKE